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SLICE - A logic probe on steroids!

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Monstermug View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monstermug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 7:40am
Fixed Thumbs Up

You get some rare footage of me playing jailbreak with my feet LOL


Edited by Monstermug - 16 Sep 2020 at 8:04am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheDaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 10:02am
Nice vid Sunny - Thanks for sharing.

Dave.

P.S Just need a few with you testing TTL now

Edited by TheDaddy - 16 Sep 2020 at 10:03am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monstermug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 10:12am
Currently got a Gunsmoke on my bench.  That is packed full of TTL's.  I can make a video of that shortly after my ankle operation in a few days time.  I spent about 30 minutes or so and preliminary diagnostics is that It's not a colour prom or rom fault.  I am almost certain it's a ttl addressing issue so will need to Slice every chip from the roms (bottom board) to the colour proms (top board) which will be fun (not!).  It's jobs like this which Slice has been designed for!  

Luckily Aaron has been very helpful and provided me with slice project so I can compare each IC with his one.  Some ic's when you slice them will show up as inactive or have errors naturally so with a working board to compare (even though it's not a physical copy) will prove invaluable.  I will start the video from where I left off.  


Edited by Monstermug - 16 Sep 2020 at 10:17am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lurch666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 12:34pm
Gun.smoke-my current nemesis.
I'm slowly using the slice to check the ICs on my gun.smoke bootleg as I have no idea how to fix my current fault.
You rang......?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheDaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 1:11pm
Awaiting your next video sunny ........

I keep saving pennies to purchase one but sadly things keep getting in the way. I realy need one as it will save me a lot of time. 

I have spoken to Aaron and he is a great guy who is very very knowledgeable and willing to help were he can - That's always a massive plus.

Hopefully get one at some point.

Dave.
AKA Wonderboy. If there is such a thing as reincarnation , knowing my luck , I will come back as me !!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lurch666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 1:32pm
Hopefully when all this virus stuff is sorted we can meet up and you can have a play with mine....Tongue
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheDaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 1:35pm
Sounds like a plan mate :-)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monstermug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 2:10pm
Originally posted by Lurch666 Lurch666 wrote:

Hopefully when all this virus stuff is sorted we can meet up and you can have a play with mine....Tongue

Make sure you wash your hands afterwards LOL

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheDaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 2:13pm
Originally posted by Monstermug Monstermug wrote:

Originally posted by Lurch666 Lurch666 wrote:

Hopefully when all this virus stuff is sorted we can meet up and you can have a play with mine....Tongue

Make sure you wash your hands afterwards LOL


I am not Angry ....... Just disappointedLOL 
AKA Wonderboy. If there is such a thing as reincarnation , knowing my luck , I will come back as me !!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gamefixer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 2:30pm
Was it this project or something else where someone proposed "sharing" libraries of working game boards so that we could have a database to work from? 

I do not know what it takes to save and create these libraries but I'd be willing to submit whatever I can. 

Slice has helped me fix 3 boards in the past 2-3 weeks. It's a great repair tool! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monstermug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 3:12pm
I'm pretty sure you just create a project, then slice every ic and save the results using the location of that IC into the project.  Nobody seemed to have read the manual for some strange reason LOL

It's not only useful for others but for yourself in case your own game breaks.  

When I have time I will start slicing all my pcbs one at a time.  Will take me a whole life time but it be well worth it.  

Maybe I should start a thread when I have enough projects saved.  I'll store them all in a dropbox account and people can just download it from there.   Too much to do and so little time Geek


Edited by Monstermug - 16 Sep 2020 at 3:12pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gamefixer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 3:19pm
LOL! I have to admit, I didnt spend a lot of time reading the manual. I wanted to get to the fun part, fixing boards! 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DanP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 5:37pm
This sounds like a job for Github.   Create a repo for these Projects and allow pull requests if someone want's to update.   Surely the real value in this tool will be if there's a large library of board data to use?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monstermug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 6:38pm
It would be nice if everyone with this unit collaborate to make this database.  I get started on all the Taito new Zealand story hardware LOL Missing plump Pop though Embarrassed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shinydaz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 10:03pm
Thanks for making the video monstermug, this would sure save me alot of time.
Out of room but always room for one more !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lurch666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 10:28pm
I mostly repair bootlegs because there's less custom chips (and they are cheaper).
Would bootleg slice info be any use to people since most tend to stay away from bootlegs?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monstermug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2020 at 10:30pm
Bootlegs would be more probably be more useful as usually they are wildly different to the original pcbs and are a pita to repair.   If you have a robocop bootleg I could use the project file for that! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bones Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2020 at 1:01am
    Looks like an invaluable piece of kit, how would you go about purchasing one ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lurch666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2020 at 1:05am
Originally posted by Monstermug Monstermug wrote:

Bootlegs would be more probably be more useful as usually they are wildly different to the original pcbs and are a pita to repair.   If you have a robocop bootleg I could use the project file for that! 


I do happen to have a bootleg robocop.
I'll make a start.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GadgetFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2020 at 11:59am
Originally posted by bones bones wrote:

Looks like an invaluable piece of kit, how would you go about purchasing one ?

Send me a PM on the forum (GadgetFreak)

Originally posted by Lurch666 Lurch666 wrote:

Would bootleg slice info be any use to people since most tend to stay away from bootlegs?

Some bootlegs are very close to original boards, especially the ones that just replace the customs with plug in boards. Though this can make Slicing a board a bit more of a challenge if the plugins obscure some of the TTL.

Originally posted by DanP DanP wrote:

Surely the real value in this tool will be if there's a large library of board data to use?

It is definitely added value but even without Existing Projects Slice is a useful tool.

Github could be used but generally once a Full Project for a board is made it would not need to be updated.

There are 2 levels of Projects really, the simplest is just a Project that contains all the Locations/IC's which makes it easy to get started with testing on a board.
The best Projects are ones that have also then had Results grabs done of all the locations on the board and also have all the binary ROM/PROM data added for comparison. They would also then have had the parameters for each location tweaked for timing and triggers if needed. These then allow for a direct comparison of the board under test with the Results from a working board.

When making a full Project though you need to stick to some guidelines to make it useful. Such as having Averaging turned on and say 60 Cycles for a 10ms sample. It also helps to start the Sampling at roughly the same point in the Demo sequence or having the board in a test mode. Each Result grab can have a line of text added which can be handy for any notes.

I always intend to make full projects but usually get sidetracked with fixing the board and end up with a mess of Results grabs or incomplete locations. To date I have only done a Proper project for Atari System 1 TTL main board which took me about 3 hours.
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