Problem VF2 Model 2 cab > OSSC?
- Thread starter Skycron
- Start date
I didn't change any settings on OSSC or RT4K.
All recent footage was captured using OBS with a Magewell Pro Capture HDMI 4K Plus, I bought it off eBay for under £150.
Previously I used a Magewell Pro Capture HDMI 1080p version with equally good results.
Using the Sega buffer board reduces a lot of noise and helps retain image quality.
All recent footage was captured using OBS with a Magewell Pro Capture HDMI 4K Plus, I bought it off eBay for under £150.
Previously I used a Magewell Pro Capture HDMI 1080p version with equally good results.
Using the Sega buffer board reduces a lot of noise and helps retain image quality.
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Gotcha. I’ve got an Elgato HD60S+ which seems to work for me. I’m using the Extron 160 which I’m pretty happy with. When I’m a little more advanced I might look into screwing around with a Sega buffer board. The Magewells work fantastically as I use them for corporate livestreams as a backup feed for vMix/ OBS. I generally don’t use it for VG streaming as my build of OBS is a little finicky with it and involves a lot of swearing. When I stream I just want OBS to see it and go and I’ve been lucky with the Elgato as I got it at a used shop for the equivalent of about £50.
I haven’t built the audio cable yet. I assume that you are just using normal speaker wire stripped and going from the 4 pin (2 threads for L and 2 for R on the JST-NH side) to the RCA? Also, the cool little amp you were using before (not the Soundblaster amp), who makes that? Would like to source one of those guys.
One of the first capture cards I bought for capturing HDMI footage was a Blackmagic Intensity Pro, that thing was so picky with signals that I ended up switching to Magewell and I've never looked back. Magewell cards just work, no faffing, and you can have multiple cards in one PC, unlike Blackmagic at the time. No idea about Elgato as I've never used them.
I've never had any issues with Magewell on OBS, and I've used quite a few models. The first Generation cards even captured 24k footage, I bought a few Dual DVI XI200XE Mini cards NOS for about £20 each a while ago, if you can get a First Generation card for cheap, they are really amazing for the price. You don't need OSSC to get a decent image as they capture analogue directly. You do have to change the resolution manually but the results speak for themselves:
>Sound
Yes, making the sound cable is as you describe.
>Pocket Amp
I got mine from here about 14 years ago:
http://electric-avenues.com/
It's still running great and comes with a lifetime warranty, it was well worth the money.
I'm not sure if the guy still sells them though, I guess you could email him using the website?
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Ouch, yeah. BM stuff would definitely give you grief for this kind of thing. The Blackmagic line is not something you would want to use for game recording/streaming. Coming from a traditional linear broadcast background, they are designed for constant signal that tend not to have any pulse or voltage fluctuations (or to be more precise - technically, everything will have SOME voltage fluctuation, but within a much smaller tolerance level). This is why they are fantastic in OB trucks because they tend to help maintain a regulated signal. When you have signals that have slight pulses in voltage, which will happen in microbursts as you do with slight changes in the signal (resolution, signal type, etc) a traditional broadcast connector will drop. They just don’t do well with phase. Even with broadcast equipment, you still want an UpDownCross converter to regulate the signal. However it still won’t account for voltage regulation so they’ll just be a disaster for games — or any kind of input source, really — that have different resolutions etc.
I use them all the time and they are amazing as long as it is a strong broadcast signal without any fluctuations. Any other use you would want to avoid them. Ironically the “pickiness” is what makes them as good as they are for their intended purpose, but they’re a lot more anal accepting input for anything else it wasn’t exactly designed for. Even AJA broadcast converters are more forgiving than BM ones - but they also cost a lot more, so it’s basically a matter of how far you want to bend over with this sort of thing, I’m afraid.
Moreover, the Blackmagic converters are just as picky now as they were then. They are quite anal with signal input and consistency.
I’ll definitely send the guy a note about the Pocket Amp.
I use them all the time and they are amazing as long as it is a strong broadcast signal without any fluctuations. Any other use you would want to avoid them. Ironically the “pickiness” is what makes them as good as they are for their intended purpose, but they’re a lot more anal accepting input for anything else it wasn’t exactly designed for. Even AJA broadcast converters are more forgiving than BM ones - but they also cost a lot more, so it’s basically a matter of how far you want to bend over with this sort of thing, I’m afraid.
Moreover, the Blackmagic converters are just as picky now as they were then. They are quite anal with signal input and consistency.
I’ll definitely send the guy a note about the Pocket Amp.
I suppose the one question I would have for you with respect to the audio cable is what size crimp is needed for the 4 pin NH connector that’s going to go in the CN13 end of the board?
I’m finding that the NH size connectors are a lot more difficult to find information on gauge, size etc. XH, PH and the like is no problem - tons of resources for that but NH info is a tad skint. I’m even finding it hard to find strippers that reference NH - again, seems to be heavy on XH, PH, etc. I do very little JST crimping (though I do do some and am comfortable doing it) - just want to make sure I buy the correct crimp and crimper.
I’m finding that the NH size connectors are a lot more difficult to find information on gauge, size etc. XH, PH and the like is no problem - tons of resources for that but NH info is a tad skint. I’m even finding it hard to find strippers that reference NH - again, seems to be heavy on XH, PH, etc. I do very little JST crimping (though I do do some and am comfortable doing it) - just want to make sure I buy the correct crimp and crimper.
Tried emailing Gary but apparently he has dropped off the face of the earth. I found a Reddit post referencing that as of about a year ago he just sort of disappeared, although his site is active.
Hopefully he will respond soon as I always like to support businesses like this. If i don’t hear back from him soon, my alternate option is the JDS Labs Atom Amp+, which appears to be the current version of the O2 which was compared pretty well with Gary’s offering. It costs more but, they’re actually shipping and I need an amp, so.
Also I was able to find the crimp I needed at an electronics shop near me so I’m good. Thanks again!
Hopefully he will respond soon as I always like to support businesses like this. If i don’t hear back from him soon, my alternate option is the JDS Labs Atom Amp+, which appears to be the current version of the O2 which was compared pretty well with Gary’s offering. It costs more but, they’re actually shipping and I need an amp, so.
Also I was able to find the crimp I needed at an electronics shop near me so I’m good. Thanks again!
Hello, all, hope everyone had a happy Christmas/holidays. I managed to get all the components I needed including the Extron 160x. The audio was ridiculously easy to get duplexed out, so thanks for that. I'm now ready to finish this up, but I wanted to get your input as to whether I am barking up the wrong tree with video cabling.
So.
When I looked at my machine and how Sega decided to get the video signal out from CN7, I noticed they had a normal 5-pin JST-NH connector. However, instead of going straight to the neckboard as 5 pins, they split the cabling with a coupler halfway to the neckboard by bunching RGB on its own, and the H/V on its own (both in the middle). At the neckboard, it then recombines into a normal 5-pin. So it goes 5 pin > 3 pin/2 pin split > recombine at 5 pin at the termination point. (In this diagram what is in the yellow box is what Sega did.
I don't want to get too close to the neckboard given its uncomfortable proximity to the flyback, so I am trying to T this in the simplest way I can while maintaining the signal path as much as possible without tearing too much apart.
My thoughts were to unseat the female JST-NH video cable from CN7 from the board that runs to the monitor, then create a new female JST-NH Y-cable of sorts by T-ing the R, G, B, H, and V cables. The base of the T would be of course crimped and seated in the 5 pin JST-NH female connector, which would be reseated into CN7. The connecting ends of my doubled-up T would go to the corresponding pins on my VGA terminal block to go to the OSSC, and the other ends would be fashioned into a 5-pin male JST-NH. This would then connect to the existing JST-NH female cable that was originally seated directly into CN7. Something like this:
My thoughts/hope is that with a simple Y-splitter like this, the monitor is still getting exactly what it needs from the board without interference as in theory it is not getting more voltage injected into it. The part that goes into the Extron is the only part needing any sort of voltage boost to get a line level signal to the OSSC and consequently the capture card.
(If I should solder the T-ed base before crimping to improve signal flow, let me know - and what kind of solder if so)
I have T-ed lots of cables before, but not this particular kind of video cable, so if this method of splitting the signal per this diagram is completely barmy, let me know.
It would be my first time, hence the mix of stupid questions with the odd flash of general competence.
Would welcome your thoughts as I am quite excited to soon be able to get this working
So.
When I looked at my machine and how Sega decided to get the video signal out from CN7, I noticed they had a normal 5-pin JST-NH connector. However, instead of going straight to the neckboard as 5 pins, they split the cabling with a coupler halfway to the neckboard by bunching RGB on its own, and the H/V on its own (both in the middle). At the neckboard, it then recombines into a normal 5-pin. So it goes 5 pin > 3 pin/2 pin split > recombine at 5 pin at the termination point. (In this diagram what is in the yellow box is what Sega did.
I don't want to get too close to the neckboard given its uncomfortable proximity to the flyback, so I am trying to T this in the simplest way I can while maintaining the signal path as much as possible without tearing too much apart.
My thoughts were to unseat the female JST-NH video cable from CN7 from the board that runs to the monitor, then create a new female JST-NH Y-cable of sorts by T-ing the R, G, B, H, and V cables. The base of the T would be of course crimped and seated in the 5 pin JST-NH female connector, which would be reseated into CN7. The connecting ends of my doubled-up T would go to the corresponding pins on my VGA terminal block to go to the OSSC, and the other ends would be fashioned into a 5-pin male JST-NH. This would then connect to the existing JST-NH female cable that was originally seated directly into CN7. Something like this:
My thoughts/hope is that with a simple Y-splitter like this, the monitor is still getting exactly what it needs from the board without interference as in theory it is not getting more voltage injected into it. The part that goes into the Extron is the only part needing any sort of voltage boost to get a line level signal to the OSSC and consequently the capture card.
(If I should solder the T-ed base before crimping to improve signal flow, let me know - and what kind of solder if so)
I have T-ed lots of cables before, but not this particular kind of video cable, so if this method of splitting the signal per this diagram is completely barmy, let me know.
It would be my first time, hence the mix of stupid questions with the odd flash of general competence.
Would welcome your thoughts as I am quite excited to soon be able to get this working
As I mentioned previously, you'll likely get some sort of dimming when splitting the video signal into 2 outputs. You can try it yourself though and see what happens.
Because you now have an Extron 160xi, that has 1 VGA input and 2 outputs:
VGA buffer out and BNC out.
For best image quality I'd personally go:
CN7 connector > Extron VGA in.
Extron VGA Buffer out > OG CN7 cable that goes to your monitor.
Extron BNC out to OSSC using a BNC to VGA cable.
I've already explained your options in post 10, so I'm not gonna repeat what's already been posted.
Good luck.
Because you now have an Extron 160xi, that has 1 VGA input and 2 outputs:
VGA buffer out and BNC out.
For best image quality I'd personally go:
CN7 connector > Extron VGA in.
Extron VGA Buffer out > OG CN7 cable that goes to your monitor.
Extron BNC out to OSSC using a BNC to VGA cable.
I've already explained your options in post 10, so I'm not gonna repeat what's already been posted.
Good luck.
Fixed.
Fair. I figured if the Extron was powered it would keep it from dimming but I guess not.
Technically however your cable management solution is easier. I have enough wires and VGA cable blocks so making a couple of these is not a big deal. I don’t really want to rip up my only OG cable, so I will just make a short VGA > JST-NH 5 pin male end, and then just plug that into the OG cable that goes into the monitor.
Would that work?
Technically however your cable management solution is easier. I have enough wires and VGA cable blocks so making a couple of these is not a big deal. I don’t really want to rip up my only OG cable, so I will just make a short VGA > JST-NH 5 pin male end, and then just plug that into the OG cable that goes into the monitor.
Would that work?
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John Bennett
Senior Member
I can barely remember this thread :-D If I said T-ing, as a disclaimer, I basically meant the signal was compatible - didn't need to go through scalers, processors whatever.
As Vamino says, the brightness might dip as you might be putting two 70ohm loads on a VGA signal (i.e. a lot). In which case it'll need an amplifier.
At this point I'd love to produce a £10 homemade amplifier, but I never soldered any up after making a batch of blank PCBs. Cross that hurdle when you get to it.
As Vamino says, the brightness might dip as you might be putting two 70ohm loads on a VGA signal (i.e. a lot). In which case it'll need an amplifier.
At this point I'd love to produce a £10 homemade amplifier, but I never soldered any up after making a batch of blank PCBs. Cross that hurdle when you get to it.
70 ohms is a lot of load. That makes sense.
The cables themselves were easy to make - I had two extra cables from a Virtua Fighter 1 Model 1 board and Virtua Racing board I wasn’t using, so I just stripped the end of each of them to go to their respective VGA terminal blocks. 5 pin for CN7 to go via VGA to the Extron, VGA to the 6 pin (even though there’s only 5 leads) to go from the Extron back to the monitor. I haven’t connected the cables I made yet, but the pin outs match, so they should work. The only cable I don’t yet have is the BNC to VGA to get the signal from the Extron to the OSSC, so I’ll have to get that online.
I was going to get this BNC to VGA cable to go from the BNC out of the Extron to the VGA of the OSSC - let me know if this would work?
The cables themselves were easy to make - I had two extra cables from a Virtua Fighter 1 Model 1 board and Virtua Racing board I wasn’t using, so I just stripped the end of each of them to go to their respective VGA terminal blocks. 5 pin for CN7 to go via VGA to the Extron, VGA to the 6 pin (even though there’s only 5 leads) to go from the Extron back to the monitor. I haven’t connected the cables I made yet, but the pin outs match, so they should work. The only cable I don’t yet have is the BNC to VGA to get the signal from the Extron to the OSSC, so I’ll have to get that online.
I was going to get this BNC to VGA cable to go from the BNC out of the Extron to the VGA of the OSSC - let me know if this would work?
StarTech.com 6 ft. (1.8 m) VGA to BNC Cable - HD15 VGA to 5 BNC - Coaxial High Resolution - Male/Male - BNC Cable (VGABNC5) : Amazon.ca: Electronics
StarTech.com 6 ft. (1.8 m) VGA to BNC Cable - HD15 VGA to 5 BNC - Coaxial High Resolution - Male/Male - BNC Cable (VGABNC5) : Amazon.ca: Electronics
www.amazon.ca
Some people are saying the H and V on the Startech cable is wrong, what make of BNC to RGB cable would you guys recommend?
To avoid frustration I can always get this one instead, though it will cost more: https://www.retrotink.com/shop/hd2b...q5DHiJAqWLUESnz8UjmPGM9oKs1ouWs0aAkPhEALw_wcB
To avoid frustration I can always get this one instead, though it will cost more: https://www.retrotink.com/shop/hd2b...q5DHiJAqWLUESnz8UjmPGM9oKs1ouWs0aAkPhEALw_wcB
The problem here is if I recommend a specific cable and it doesn't work then I'll be the one to blame. I tested shed loads of equipment before I settled on using the Sega buffer board with my capture setup, but it's been quite a few years since I did that. I know for a fact I got dimming when T-ing the video cable though, even with the brightness+contrast turned up to max on the monitor the image was still dim. I think you can also use BNC via the Scart input on the OSSC too, but I never went down that route so I can't confirm.
Pretty sure I also had success using some BNC to RCA adapters connected to a component cable which was then connected directly to the upscaler. I also went through the rigmarole of connecting an OG Xbox via component cables to play SpikeOut Battle Street on my Blast City using a custom control panel, and I definitely used that Startech BNC to VGA cable and 160xi in that loop as well.
You are pretty much there now, but I'm afraid you'll have to Google the last step.
I don't know the exact cable I used so I can't recommend what you should buy.
Pretty sure I also had success using some BNC to RCA adapters connected to a component cable which was then connected directly to the upscaler. I also went through the rigmarole of connecting an OG Xbox via component cables to play SpikeOut Battle Street on my Blast City using a custom control panel, and I definitely used that Startech BNC to VGA cable and 160xi in that loop as well.
You are pretty much there now, but I'm afraid you'll have to Google the last step.
I don't know the exact cable I used so I can't recommend what you should buy.
Fair. Well the last step pretty much falls right into broadcast engineering, so if it ends up being a pin issue with respect to the BNC / VGA then I can always desolder and switch the pins around in the cable. For the conservative equivalent of about £16-£17 I’m completely fine with tearing it apart if need be.
I shall post my results here.
I shall post my results here.
OK, I dug out my OSSC and done a simple test.
VGA out from Model 3 > Extron 160xi > Extron BNC to OSSC using Startech BNC-VGA cable = No image.
VGA out from Model 3 > Extron 160xi > Extron BNC to RT4K using Startech BNC-VGA cable = Triple image, there may be a setting I can change but it's not usable.
I can't find my connectors so can't test any further, using a standard component cable with BNC to RCA adapters may be your solution.
VGA out from Model 3 > Extron 160xi > Extron BNC to OSSC using Startech BNC-VGA cable = No image.
VGA out from Model 3 > Extron 160xi > Extron BNC to RT4K using Startech BNC-VGA cable = Triple image, there may be a setting I can change but it's not usable.
I can't find my connectors so can't test any further, using a standard component cable with BNC to RCA adapters may be your solution.
BNC to PHONO Connector CCTV FEMALE camera Cable MONITOR RCA SOCKET ADAPTER MALE | eBay UK
1x BNC adapter Male to RCA Phono female. With this you can convert a BNC PLUG to RCA Phono. for use with a Composite Video Cable, such as the type used with CCTV systems. HDTVI 1080P HIGH DEF CCTV. CCTV DVR RECORDERS.
www.ebay.co.uk
Here's an OG Xbox stream I did using that Startech cable, Extron 160xi and a component to VGA adapter. That setup was very messy, I went through so many hoops to be able to play in the Blast City and capture at the same time, but it worked and that's all I needed.
It's quite difficult to capture a bright image from Xbox, there was a setting I changed in OBS to make the image appear brighter but I can't remember what it is now.
It's quite difficult to capture a bright image from Xbox, there was a setting I changed in OBS to make the image appear brighter but I can't remember what it is now.